Trainer List of Skills and Spells

[Virisin]

Cleave/behead/encircle need to be weakened a bit.. Currently they're like superskills. Then you can just list them like all the other skills/spells, which is how they should be.

[Iwku]

I would agree that it would be a mistake not to post the trainer/zone for behead and cleave, or for any skill/spell for that matter.

My experience with this new system has been limited because I was a Tier 4 thief when it started, and I am still a Tier 4 thief, and so I only had to find one or two trainers. One of the trainers I had to find was for encircle. I was initially opposed to the new system, especially when the clue for the encircle skill was .... well, no clue. The trainer could be anywhere in any dimension.

To me, such vagueness wasn't much fun or challenging. It was just frustrating and made me feel like calling it quits. When the zone where the encircle trainer was announced, it was a challenge because that zone was huge but it was fun. I tried stuff I never had before (like flying my own spaceship). I found a new really cool area, a really intriguing quest, a flag and got a token. And as a side bonus I encounted a few people on my travels to find where these skill trainers were and got into a conversation with them - something that wouldn't have happened otherwise. Those experiences made me warm somewhat to this new system.

The goal of the system is to get people exploring. So why single out hunters and warriers who might want to try behead or cleave? Why make it so difficult? If finding trainers is too hard, people just might bypass those skills and level on and then if they reach GM they won't even know what those skills are like and if they want to chose that class. Or even if they don't reach GM, they will miss out on some fun things of a class. Or, they might just say to themselves, this is stupid and too much of a hassle.

Anyway Virisin as far as encircle being overpowered...maybe it is, maybe not. But you lose kick when you reach level 4 thief so unless you have a mount that can trample you pretty much just sit there helpless and watch the fight on the screen scroll by. Encircle is essential! And behead and cleave are probably just as essential.

So my vote is for the more information the better.

[Virisin]

If finding trainers is too hard, people just might bypass those skills and level on and then if they reach GM they won't even know what those skills are like and if they want to chose that class. Or even if they don't reach GM, they will miss out on some fun things of a class. Or, they might just say to themselves, this is stupid and too much of a hassle.

Anyway Virisin as far as encircle being overpowered...maybe it is, maybe not. But you lose kick when you reach level 4 thief so unless you have a mount that can trample you pretty much just sit there helpless and watch the fight on the screen scroll by. Encircle is essential! And behead and cleave are probably just as essential.

If people bypass learning encircle/cleave/behead they'd learn a damn sight more about the class they were in than if they learnt the skills. Learning them just means you can forget every other skill the class knows, because all you need is that one skill.

Yes, yes, they're essential now, especially encircle because it's the only aggressive skill Thieves get.

[erwin]

Well, considering the many zones in the mud, it is possible for a T4 low remort thief to remort entirely without getting encircle, just by exploring (and killing mobs along the way). However, yes, it is pretty boring.

Thieves do get more skills than encircle, but Virisin is right, encircle is the ONLY aggressive skill / useful currently.

Strangle - (subskills which help are currently locked in Fenizia, so strangle doesn't help that much). Even then, strangle only works on T0 mobs. T1, T2, T3, and T4 mobs ignore the effects and attack.
Flank - Skill not done
Poison Weapon (Most poison objects are locked in Fenizia, and most mobs which are a toughie are sadly !POISON)
Trap Aware - Bugged again, thieves can't flee and attack from the shadows, rather, they have to duke it out like a warrior style
Slip - Only useful in PK, mobs which hit hard surprisingly have very little inventory room to slip objects into, and as snare is a T1 skill, slip can easily backfire without trap aware.

If encircle were to get weakened, I'd say it should be done only after the above 4 skills are looked into, else thief would become worse than ranger

[Molly]

I am currently working on revamping Fenizia, so it should be opened again in foreseeable time, with a cute new feature added.

As for poison weapon; if you provide a list with tough mobs immune to poison, I'll think about removing it from some of them, since it is a nice skill, which should be used more.
The entire Fenizia zone was once built around that single skill.

The rest is for the Coders to do something about. Regrettably they all seem to be more or less AWOL at present. *sigh*

[Virisin]

It's not as simple as just removing the poison immunity though... It needs some indepth coding behind it or poison WILL be overpowered. But yes, currently everyone basically fights like a warrior - duking it out with the mob till one of them dies. Even casters.. There's no seperation or uniqueness, cept for a different set of eq between casters and fighters/rogues.

[erwin]

I play with directionals as caster, what fight like a warrior?

But..hmm..I'm not sure what constitutes as a tough mob, considering the percentage chance of poison affecting mobs. I'd say poison 1 is useless for tiered mobs level 60+ish, you can poison them with poison 1, they can remain poisoned for 3-4 days without reboots, and still be at full HP, since they regen more HP than poison. Poison 2, poison 3, and poison 4 should be the main weapons of a thief though, but given that they work rather infrequently (I'm not sure if poison 3ing or poison 4ing the balrog works), most of the time when the poison actually affects the mob, he's already half dead.

I have no idea what tough mobs are, sadly, since I do admit I use encircle on most of them.

[Fizban]

It's not as simple as just removing the poison immunity though... It needs some indepth coding behind it or poison WILL be overpowered. But yes, currently everyone basically fights like a warrior - duking it out with the mob till one of them dies. Even casters.. There's no seperation or uniqueness, cept for a different set of eq between casters and fighters/rogues.

Examples? Of code changes you feel would be needed if the immunities were removed that is.