Class System Overhaul (Aye or Nay)

[Xeriuth]

Are you pleased with our current class system? Would you like to see something new? Do you fancy GM? Do you feel that there are enough skills/spells to justifiable differentiate between each and every class? Do you like monkeys? Feel free to release your idea's and be foot loose and fancy free in this thread. Any ideas would be much appreciated, as to how to amend the current system.

[Xeriuth]

Classless system anyone?

[Kvetch]

To make a classless system work, you basically have to have lots of useful skills/spells choices but not a lot of skill points to put in them.  For example 100 skills/spells and only 50 skill points.  That way you can't choose each skill and put 1 point in each and then increase their ability by using them.  Or, perhaps make it so there's 100 skill points but at most you can only choose 25 skills out of a list of 100.  If you have 100 skills/spells and 100 skill points and the ability to increase your skill or spell by using it, then you'll end up with people with all 100 skills/spells at 100%.

If you have some basically useless skills/spells (while I like create food and create water, do you think I'd choose that skill or spell when I can just recall go east and drink to my hearts content or would I keep the points for something else?) then no-one will chose them.  Or they'll get chosen by someone that doesn't know why they're "useless" and then later when the player figures it out they'll ask if they can change it.

Virisin, I believe it was, had started a post somewhere about skills/spells that were useful and those that were useless - or maybe he didn't start it but he did contribute a lot to it.  I think doing that would be a first step towards any revamping of our current system.

Kvetchy

[Xeriuth]

Perhaps give a buff to food from create food and water items? Like a +health and +mana? Just a thought to make a useless spell more useful.

[erwin]

Skill points from *more difficult* quests?

Though, most offensive spells currently are just "damage", perhaps modified with terrain as well. For example, I could dump points in Shocking Grasp and level quite well in Jurassic Ocean, but then get 0.16 multipliers at times in Little Italy. I'm not sure if I'm generalizing this, but choosing spells then would just mean choosing the zones you would want to level in, if looked at in the levelling point of view.

Also, some of the T3/T4 offensive spells are not as good as the T1 ones. For example, I believe Demonshreak changes its multiplier based on the alignment of players, so you have a 1/3rd chance (slightly less, since players/mobs aren't equally aligned distributed) of doing major damage. Unfortunately, harm can achieve a multiplier of 2.60 (or 2.70), and that's a T1 spell. Mana blast, Electric blast are also spells that have potential, but are outclassed by lower tier spells.

Not sure if such a classless system would then lead to players (optimally) choosing the few offensive spells which will give them the most bang for their buck, unless these spells were revamped.

*Disclaimer: This is what I remember from a few months back, so the spells could very well be different.

[Kvetch]

Also, some of the T3/T4 offensive spells are not as good as the T1 ones. For example, I believe Demonshreak changes its multiplier based on the alignment of players, so you have a 1/3rd chance (slightly less, since players/mobs aren't equally aligned distributed) of doing major damage. Unfortunately, harm can achieve a multiplier of 2.60 (or 2.70), and that's a T1 spell. Mana blast, Electric blast are also spells that have potential, but are outclassed by lower tier spells.

Demonshreak probably has a higher base that gets multiplied than harm does.  If harm does 50 points base and gets multiplied by 3 then it does 150 points damage, if Demonshreak has a 100 point base and gets multiplied by 2, it still does more damage.  And yes, those are only numbers.  I've not seen code, I don't know the exact numbers, but my guess would be that demonshreak is T/whatever due to the base compared to harm.

Kvetchy

[Hayato]

Ugh, voted Nay when I meant Aye.  (I read Xeriuth's first sentence and voted based on that =P)

Well since I'm here: Could always do a classless system, but restrict skills within professions or specializations, and you can choose to spend your points focusing on a branch, or picking up multiple skilltrees, but be weak in all of them.

[Tocharaeh]

I am down for an overhaul, but not going to a classes system. I like the idea of classes because it creates a kind of individualism. Gives everyone their own special niche.

What we need is a true tier system that allows everyone to choose their own walk of life. I wanna see REAL casters, warriors, and rogues.

           
Warrior >> Ranger/Swordsman/Hunter
Priest(Cleric actually) >> Priest/Crusader/Avatar
Mage >> Enchanter/Witch(Warlock)/Shaman
Rogue (Thief actually) >> Assassin/Gypsy/Cut-purse (or something)
Bard (HELL YES)>> Jungalier(I think thats how its spelled)/Rock Star/Disc Jockey (hehe)

51 levels per tier. Either you make it a two tier system or you COULD keep it a 4 tier system, and then just have everyone play everything along their chosen proffession list! Then, why not allow people to once they've hit the Final tier get a GM title for the given path, and get a brand new name for whatever class it is. It'd be way awesome. Otherwise, a nice 2 tier system where people start off with the above (basic) >> (final). But then again a (basic) >>(progressive)>>(final) works too. I'd love to see an actual class system rather than our cluster fuck of classes.

Now if people don't think GM was the final goal...I think you're wrong. It most certainly is the final goal whether Virisin says so or not. It most certainly is. In terms of class structure.

personally the updated code was a quick copy and paste of ideas someone wrote in MS Word, and didn't truly think anything through. I honestly think so. With everything that's gone in so far, I tend to believe it more and more because I've never seen a series of less thought out ideas implemented so quickly before up until 4d decided to do it. This is what happen when you have what you THINK is a good idea, and not bother to ask the pbase about it.