Future Clan Contests

[Virisin]

The way I see it, if it loads on a shopkeeper that's just one repop you won't be able to get the deed, it's not like it's going to load on an unkillable mob every time, heck it's not even gonna load every time, so it's kinda just an inherent increase in difficulty to obtain a deed.

I'm not sure if this is a good or bad thing, but if it was done this way, it would be possible to 'locate deed' and see the deeds that were currently in the game. Even if they're !locate, you can still see if it's loaded or not. This seems like a bad thing, and I guess this might be why whoever implemented it tried to do it the way they did. Having it so every unique mob you kill in a zone increases your chance of collecting a deed slightly, to 'encourage' more diverse killing. Not sure if that's actually what they did, but I hope so.

Heh, I always thought some revolutionary mud could make a shitton of glorious features if they had monthly p-wipes. Not full p-wipes, but some kind of monthly reset. That's a whole nother story though. And I think I actually agree with you, I would prefer if they didn't reset every month.

A toggle for the gossips would be good.

[Asmodeus]

Ok.  I'm posting this because Horus is throwing a shitfit and getting mad at me over tells, and because for some reason he thinks me posting this will solve all the problems.  The following is my opinion: for the way deeds are set up now, I think the current load percent works well.  There is no need to set it higher.  Sometimes the deed loads right away, sometimes it takes a few repops of slaughtering an entire zone to get a deed.


That being said, this is the last thing I'm going to say on the matter of deeds for a while.  Thank you Temes for helping me realize this.


I still maintain that deeds are stupid.  I have said this from the beginning.  "Why," you ask, "are you collecting so many deeds then, Asmodeus?  Grinding is obviously a huge PITA when you're not receiving any benefits from it."  Good question, fellow 4Der.  Here's the real answer that really didn't cross over from my subconscious until talking with Temes.

The real reason I am collecting deeds is because all the people in Chaos are collecting deeds.  For us, collecting deeds is more of a fun activity than race to obtain perks.  They're just a fun group to be around and work together with.  When we're all online spread around the realms deed-hunting, our ctell is a lot of fun to watch.  To be honest, if Loran and Temes and Kito and, yes, for a moment even Jaros, weren't trying to collect deeds and having fun with it, would I be going out and collecting them? Probably not.  

All of you can sit here and angrily debate deeds and their purposes and their mechanics  and their load percentages until the cows come home (and yes, I've been throwing in my opinion because I have been taking part in actually collecting them and just want to help), but Chaos is just going to keep hanging out and having fun with this "clan-building activity".  I love you guys!



One more thing and I'm finished, I promise...  Temes couldnt have said it better:



Message 36 : Sun Jun 12 (Temes)      :: Deeds are sucky?

"Deeds are no fun if your clan is small, riven with strife, or plain sucky. All other clans on 4D are."
"So yes, deeds are a great idea. For Chaos, and only Chaos."
"I'm not complaining about the deeds. Chaos is enjoying them. Thank you very much!"


Asmo out.
*drops the mic*

[Xeriuth]

Wanted to touch on a few things real quick.

I agree there should be global chats of when a deed changes hands, claimed initially and who claimed it. And preferably toggleable. Could perhaps just have it chatted over quest channel, and you can toggle quest on and off whether you want to hear it or not.

I think the way deeds load is fine, at least you have a potential chance of loading it every reboot. If a deed would load on a shopkeeper during a reboot, you'd pretty much be screwed for 5 days at some times because the mud does not crash anywhere near as often as it once did.

There should be milestones for specific amount of deeds and respective bonuses. I think they should also be cumulative bonuses. As I've mentioned before the top prize being when a clan manages to claim all deeds in the game. At a point such as that, I think that would be an appropriate time to have a global reset of deeds, and start from scratch once more. It's a hard feat to achieve let along maintain, hence the reward should be permanent for hitting max deeds, even as subtle as name on a plaque or any number of things.

Changes to mobs and how they act in a zone would be a nice feature to have added, but not priority. I think the milestones is a better thing to hit, mainly to give incentive to finding deeds because the current  bonuses don't cut it. This would of course help resolve the grinding aspect to make it better in the fact of being more desirable, having an actual purpose, and will help being selective of where you hunt.

I don't think forcing anyone into pk due to deeds is wise.  
Will touch on more at a later time. That is all for now.

[Xeriuth]

Hmm, Asmo, is that a recruitment post for Chaos?

[horus]

Asmo is sneaky like that.

[Xeriuth]

A quick idea, wondering what you all thing, but with this talk about ctells and how it can be fun and lively. What about a small feature to get it going, clan alliances... which can precede clan wars possibly. If two clans like each other enough they can ally, once done they can hear but ctells, of their own and other clan. I'm not sure how hard this would be to code, but could prove to be very interesting and fun. Any ideas, thoughts?

[Loria]

Clan alliances would be a fun way of helping small clans and bigger clans. The small clans would get help in wars and also, depending upon the treaty agreement, could also get financial help, etc. The bigger clans would benefit too but in less materialistic ways. Helping out a smaller clan not only feels good but it can be sort of a status builder.

There are many different types of alliances. Some alliances will be made simply as a financial charity to a struggling clan. Some may provide protection or support if a war is waged on their ally but not declared by the ally, some may even go a step further and agree to support their ally in any/all wars even those their ally declared.

In order to have alliances, there would be a need for diplomats. Clans can decide if they want to set up an internal structure in their gov't to manage the foriegn affairs and appoint a leader over that department which would still be under the CL. And as long as it is peace time, giving a newbie a diplomat job is a good way to build friendships which leads to more permanent activity. Obviously you would want a knowledgable player to be the diplomat to a clan where there are serious issues to hash out.

If there are diplomats and treaties, there would need to be a place/channel for the two (or more) clans to discuss business. perhaps there can be a room within each clanhall built to allow other clans' diplomats in with certain restrictions? Diplomats could be another way of resolving problems without going to war.

These are just some thoughts I had on the subject. I am all for allowing alliances. It would add a new depth to the game.

[Molly]

While waiting for any bigger changes to the Clan system to be worked on, I am about to finish my King of the Clans idea. Sice it's been some time since I mentioned it, I'll describe the idea once more:

* A strong mob would be teleporting all over the world, and when found and  killed would have a 50 percent chance of loading the King of Clans Crown. The possession of this item would symbolically make a Clan 'King of Clans', a bit along the same idea as the Blue Band of Victory.
* The crown has to be dropped in the room with the Deed box for certain benefits to work. As long as the item remains in this room, the members get the benefits from it.
* Only one Clan can possess the crown at the same time. As soon as another Clan gets it and drops it in their Clan Hall, the possession of the title goes over to them, and the other item is purged.
* The crown can also be stolen, if and when we open the Clan halls.
* The Crown will also disappear when the mud reboots or crashes.

What I'd want input on from the players is what the Clan reward would be. It should be pretty good, since potentially any Clan can get the crown.
We already have teleports from the deeds and the zoneflags.
So I am thinking maybe 5 free spells, but am unsure which ones would be appropriate. Suggestions, anyone?

If someone has some other good reward ideas, please share them here.

[Loria]

I like the 5 free spells idea. how about a free perz'd item? As a newb,  I don't know how much those are valued so I don't know if that is a good suggestion though.  An addition to damroll as a reward for being the strongest/best?

[Molly]

A big one-time reward is not possible, it has to be something smaller, but continuous, to work as a Clan Reward.
The crown is going to change owners many times, so it should only last as long as it is in the Clanhall.

So far free spells or timered affects is all I can think about.

[Asmodeus]

If we're going to do this open clan halls and clan raids thing, what about the current crown holder gets some sort of small discount on defenses as well as maybe 3 spells, instead of 5 spells only.  The discount only applies if they buy while they have the crown, of course.  May be a good idea because people might be trying to break into the clan and steal it.

But... are spells the right path for an award for this?  Spells are not necessarily something worth fighting for in my mind.  I don't know right now what would be worth fighting for at the moment (except maybe defense discounts), but I don't think spells are the answer.

[Virisin]

It's quite hard to give real rewards to players that can pretty much cast every spell on themselves, or quaff any others.

Asmodeus' idea is likely the best one, but even that is kinda boring and would only inspire players to become king of clans if they planned on beefing up, and once beefed up they wouldn't need the king of clans again. A better idea would probably make the king of clans just have greater clan defenses while they are king of clans. E.g. whichever clan is currently king, a badass monster protects the clan from intruders that's stronger than any possible clan defense mobs.

[Asmodeus]

Yeah, thats a better idea Viri.  Don't lower cost, but boost defense effectiveness/stats by a small percentage if your clan owns the crown.

We also need to keep awards for KoC different than what deed milestones will be.  As of right now, I kind of see them fulfilling the same purposes, just in slightly different ways.  And while they are similar, the only way to make each of them kind of worth it is by having rewards being worth it as well as different.

[Molly]

What you oldbies tend to forget is that not all players are multi remorts with every possible spell and defense.
This is for ALL Clan members, remember, and free spells in the Clanhall might be a good way to attract new members.
I was also thinking about more expensive or rare spells like Armor, Bless, Shield, Stoneskin, Vitalize.

I also like Viri's idea about defences being better only as long as the Crown is in the Clanhall.

However, there will probably be some time before we can implement Clan Raids.
What worries me about it is that it might make players leave in protest again. Some Clans might not like the idea of having their hall raided, or having to spend a lot of gold and tokens on defences.

There is a possible solution to this; making the open Clanhalls optional.
So a Clan can choose to stay out of Clan Raids altogether.
But if they do, they will also not get the benefits from the Deeds and the Crown.

What do you think?

[Xeriuth]

What rewards can there be for the King of Clans. Well this could sort of tie in with the spells thread. I think utility spells that you always have to but another for would be the better spells. Ones that you can't get from healers such as armor and bless as Molly mentioned. Vitalize is a good one. However I have an idea to throw on top of this, the KOC rewards could sort of be tiered. For instance, if clan A gets the crown, then the mob would of course still load. That same clan could go after it and claim the crown a second time in a row, to get an even better reward and so on. The moment another clan gets the crown, the clan despite the number of times they claimed the crown in a row, lose all of the rewards and have to start over. The better defenses can be work well.  Other spells that could be good are locate object, identify, or higher end levels mana shield, brace, locate person. Another potential award is to increase the experience bonus everywhere by a smaller percent, and have it stack with whether your clan owns the zone with the deed too. So 5 % extra experience everywhere and 15% in zones the clan owns, instead of the 10% it is already set at.  Or simply perhaps a temporary exp buff. for the next 2 mud days after claiming a crown, the clan gets a double exp buff, much similar to double exp holidays that we used to have. Since a crown should be a group effort to attain anyways with your clan, not a solo effort. With more players on to have gotten the crown, then they are fair game to level as well afterward as an immediate reward. just some thoughts .

A suggestion for clanhalls could be perhaps, have a section simply for raiding and another part of the clanhall for clan members only. This way clans can still be raided, but it's up to them whether they participate in raids, and in turn deeds and king of crowns. They should just be wary of storing gold in their clan treasury if they don't want to take part in raids.