Clan Ideas - The Complete Edition

[horus]

Any ideas that benefits/disadvantages clans require a complete strategy to implement it properly. Right now, there are a lot of clan activities that are purely for cosmetic purposes, including adding extra rooms, buying mobs/furniture, etc.

The way forward is to implement clan raids. This will allow other clans to pilfer/reclaim zone flags, zone deeds and clan treasury as part of their reward. Now, the clan's defences become vitally important, and clan leaders need to carefully think of their HQ's layout, spend their treasury on beefing up the mobs and other defences. Now, having a big treasury becomes important, and having your members contribute to that treasury is equally important.

How should clan raids work?
1. All clan rooms are dubbed ARENA rooms, so experience/eq etc wont be lost through deaths when PKed.
2. Defenders will get an extra bonus in their capabilities if they are in their clan HQ. I suggest defenders will do 20% more damage, and attackers will do 20% less damage.
3. Anyone dying in these clan rooms (both defenders and attackers) will not be able to enter the same clan HQ for a limited time - maybe around ten minutes.
4. Attackers cannot cast spells to enter or leave the clan rooms.
5. Once an attacker picks up an item from the clan (for example, a zone flag that gives shortcuts to a particular zone), the attacker will lose half of his hitpoints and can only heal up to half of his hitpoints until he reaches his own base.
6. An attacker can only pick up one treasury item at a time. Only two or three items can be raided at any one time.
7. Once a clan is raided, their HQ will be safe for a short period - I suggest one week.

Defences
1. All clan entrances will now be hidden entrances. Players will need to physically type search to reveal the entrance.
2. All clannies will recall OUTSIDE their clan HQ. This is where a good spy will be able to find the location of a clan HQ.
3. To move a clan entrance will cost you 5 gold tokens. (This amount is up for discussion). It will take 5 days to move the entrance, so if you suspect your secret entrance has been compromised, you will need to concentrate on beefing up your defences during the move.
4. Defender mobs will cost tokens to purchase, and tokens to level. Their upkeep per month will cost coins - the higher the level, the more costly it is to maintain them.
5. Traps also can be purchased using tokens. Traps could include those that damage attackers, or trap them in the room for a period of time. We could also discuss about traps that teleport attackers as per teleport spell. These traps will only have a limited life before they become useless or have random effects, so you will need to re-purchase the traps.

Rewards
1. You will get to keep whatever you have raided. Shortcuts to zones, or zone xp/gold bonuses from zone deeds, etc
2. You will also be rewarded with a special flag that will commemorate your achievement - Something that says Clan A got pwned by us!!
3. There will be flags that equate to zone deeds, zone flags, and clan gold. So you can raid the other clan's treasury - each flag will
represent 10 gold tokens or 100mil coins.

Maintaining your clan
You will need to make sure your clan treasury is enough to maintain your clan's defences. If your balance is below what is required of maintaining mobs/eq/traps etc, you have a chance to lose them completely and will need to repurchase them again. There will also be a delay from the time you make a deposit until the time you can spend it. This will then be the best time for clan raids to happen

Thats the rough idea I have of implementing clan raids. Please, when making comments on any specific section of clan raids, start a new post. Dont try to comment on everything on one post as there will be too many things to sift through and too many opinions on each topic.

Thanks.

[Once]

Not a bad idea, but it requires a critical mass across different clans to successfully implement. A critical mass that's currently pretty much missing. Until there's enough mass to sustain it, I think it'll just piss people off without much recourse. 

As much as I hate to say it, I think Virisin's clan idea fits better with the current environment.

[Molly]

Not a bad idea, but it requires a critical mass across different clans to successfully implement. A critical mass that's currently pretty much missing. Until there's enough mass to sustain it, I think it'll just piss people off without much recourse. 

As much as I hate to say it, I think Virisin's clan idea fits better with the current environment.

Actually I think Virisin had pretty similar ideas, if I remember right from an earlier post of his.
However, Once is also right that such a massive change as this would need a larger playerbase than our current. Maybe a feasible way would be to start the implementation in small pieces, not everything at the same time. That means we'll have to discuss which parts of the ideas that we want to prioritise, and which should better be left until a later time, (provided the playerbase actually grows).

But to actually make the playerbase grow we need to introduce some new features which could wake our oldtimers up from their absence or Recall coma, and which potential new players hopefully also would appreciate. And making Clans more competitive sounds like one possible way to raise interest.

That said, I have some practical comments to Horus suggestions. 

Whether the deeds are coded or scripted, they will be pretty useless unless they actually give some advantages. This means that we don't just need the deeds, we also need the benefits, like for instance extra exp, bargain prices and free teleports for the Clan that holds the deed in question.
(I can probably script the part that ties the deed to a room in the clan, but I'm pretty sure that the various benefits would have to be coded. This should ideally work with a menu like cedit, where imms can edit certain gameplay factors, (like for instance double experience day), without having to involve a coder for every change).

These benefits also make the deeds ideal for looting, since they follow the location of the deed.

I don't think the Zoneflags should be lootable, however, since they are the proof of a quest achievement in the past. (As it is the ones in the showcases don't even have a take flag). Objects stored in Clan Houses should also be safe from looting, otherwise it would be way too frustrating. However, I am not objected to looters being able to pilfer small amounts from the Clan treasury, or the Clan Token Treasury (we need a similar way to store Clan tokens as Clan gold by the way).

And I am sure we can think of other more or less prestiguous object that could be lootable, feel free to submit ideas.

I agree with flagging the Clan rooms Arena.

All Clans already have a physical entrance and the Clan recall should lead to that room, so I think that part is already taken care of.

[virinis]

Molly is dead-on as usual. I agree about the zone-flags too.

[Asmodeus]

wow horus, thats 2 other people who said the same thing i said to you about the zone flags.  guess its not that 'oldbie sense of entitlement' you were going on about. 

great other ideas though!

[horus]

Wow Asmo, the two who agrees with you happens to be....OLDBIES!!! Harhrah way to go for pushing your case about Oldbies :p

[virinis]

Stealing zone-flags is a terrible idea. That's like stealing hall of fame statues, obviously there's a sense of entitlement but so it should.

[horus]

Before we continue going down this silly path of statues and trophies being stolen, thats not what I meant. Achievements can never be taken away from you. What I was suggesting is the actual reward of those achievements - the shortcuts to zones because someone in your clan was the first person to find the zone flag.

If you also read the read proper, attackers are only allowed 1 - 3 items maximum they can steal. They are also at a severe disadvantage when attacking, etc. So its not something to be taken lightly.

And as for critical mass, if we planned anything based on critical mass, we might as well not add anything new. We already have more than enough zones for our current base of players.

[Asmodeus]

Molly may have to correct me here, but the trigger for a shortcut to a zone are going to be put on the zoneflags in the trophy case.  So when you get the flag from the case, it activates a script that teleports you, but you dont actually get the flag.  The flag stays in the case so others can use it.  So because you're talking about just taking the perk and not the zoneflag, i think that means there would have to be essentially two zone flags, one as a trophy that doesnt move, and one as a teleport... sounds a bit pointless to have two versions.

But whether it is on a second zoneflag or not, i still think its stupid.  Zoneflags are a trophy of a clan's hard work over something like 10 years, and there are perks associated with it.  If you're all for keeping the achievement in the clanhall, why are you for taking the reward?  To me, they're one and the same.

Stick to stealing deeds if those get implemented, that just adds another aspect on how you can recover a deed for your clan.  Either get it off a mob in the zone, or steal it from the clan currently holding it.  Or if you really want, make it so the only way to get a currently owned deed is by stealing it from the clan who currently holds it.  But leave the zoneflags alone.

Also, keep in mind that clans are going to be open, so if you REALLY wanted to use the shortcut, you could just walk into the clan and use it, but you're obviously taking a risk to get in there.

[Molly]

Actually the teleport script isn't set on the zoneflags, it's on the room with the showcase. And it's triggered by saying the name of the zone, not getting the flag. You get the info about this by looking at the showcase.
The scripts should be in the clanhalls by now, so feel free to test them for me.

Horus is right about the critical mass. If we just sit around waiting for more players to assemble, we could just as well close down 4D now.
So lets go for this feature, and also use the news of the updated Clans as an excuse to advertise on Mud Forums.

By the way, opening the Clanhalls would also present a way to deal with the apparently dead Clans. Instead of just closing them down, we could allow other players to take them over, just as the  DJs took over Qualinesti/Mordonosee Clanhall in the past. We just need to set up some rules about how to claim a Clan. Suggestions, anyone?

This also brings up another question; Who would be allowed to enter a Clanhall? Can any player do it, or do you have to be the member of a Clan - (any Clan) - to get in?

Anyhow, implementing this new feature is going to take some time, since there is much work involved, both building and coding. All Clanhalls have to be flagged Arena, the deeds have to be created in OLC, and the benefits you'll get from them have to be coded.

So while we are waiting for the bigger change to happen, how about I go ahead with the King of Clans idea that I presented in the other thread in this Forum?

KOC is much easier to do, since the entire feature only needs one mob, one object and a couple of scripts. Also the crown would present another stealable object, once we get the Clanhalls open. Stealing it from a Clanhall would probably be a lot easier than chasing the mob all over the world, hoping for it to drop the crown this time).
Feel free to suggest improvements to the original idea.

[Xeriuth]

I'll chime in on a few things in no specific order..
KOC great idea to implement to start off. Deed would be a good secondary thing to follow. Opening clans after that and will ofter another way to steal the KOC and Deeds when implemented.

The deeds do not have to be all at once. Ideally they would be, but I think my explanation on the other forum post in regards to batches and first clan to fully claim that batch wins that batch, and so on, a new deed batch is released when the previous has finished, giving shorter amount of time in the beginning to release the batches but as it progresses and the batches become harder and harder to win due to the sheer amount of zones and hopefully growing competitions, there will be a lot more time between releases and time to stage them even, ready to be released with the next winner. Can also do a plaque for deeds for the winners of each batch... just like Zone Flags.

Would be good to also have the old time function of having clan tokens. Just like the clan treasury where members can donate tokens just the same. And with these clan contests the tokens added to the clan token treasury which can make it unable to be withdrawn from for leaders to use for personal use, making minor clan competitions able to reward tokens only usable for the clan and not for leader or whomever perzes or other stuff.

Also, no need to make flags steal-able, simply giving anyone the ability to use the function would be sufficient. Making it a bonus use-able by everyone, just more convenient for the clan. So still a nice feature for the clan, but still can be tough for other clans to try and use, since they have to raid the clan to begin with.

Also I love the idea of possibly taking over clans. Perhaps this can be by several means. If a clan loses a clan war in a landslide because it has no members it can be taken over. Or perhaps a current leader or member can sell their clan to the highest bidder. Or if they can just submit and give the clan over. These clans wouldnt be gone forever as the pbase grows the clans can be occupied again. When a clan is owned by another clan, the clan can still exist, but the clan that owns it is forced to defend it. Perhaps ability for new owner to use the clans old recall item, giving access to two clanhalls if both owned. Just double the effort to defend. Also, another clan can raid the clan owned by another to steal it from them. There could be perhaps a bonus if a clan owns more than one. Not sure what would be good but, it's an idea, since this could almost be a competition of its own.

Regardless of what features there are, any clanhall should be accessible by anyone, with the ability for the clan to purchase defenses of some kind. There should at least be some rooms that are a safehaven from attack, but otherwise accessible by all.

Lots of options, those are just some disjointed thoughts of mine

[horus]

This post is addressing the issue of clan defences.

Right now, all clans are room scripted to stop people from entering the clan hall unless they belong to that clan. This should be totally removed, so that anyone and everything can enter the clan halls. So whats to stop players to enter? Look below for defence options.

The below defence options can be purchased by the clan leaders, and all costs are ARBITRARY - which means I have just put some figure down and its not even close to the actual cost.

Blocker Mob
Purchase cost: 1 gold per 10 levels    , Running cost: 50k coins per month
Upgrade options: NIL
This mob replaces the room scripts - it blocks people from going a certain direction unless they are from the same clan. This mob only serves this function and does not assist or attack anyone unless they are attacked. This mob does not roam either.
Guards
Purchase cost: 15 silvers per 10 levels, running cost: 80k per month
Upgrade options: clan war
This mob assists any clan player or clan mob when they are attacked. These mobs do not roam, but are perfect in the same room as Blockers.
Defenders
Purchase cost: 8 silvers per 10 levels, running cost: 30k per month
Upgrade options: rush assist, clan war
These mobs roam around the clan hall. They assist when any clan player/mob is attacked.
Sneaks
Same as Defenders, except they have backstabbing abilities and encircle. These mobs are hidden and sneak, but have very little hp and defences.

UPGRADE OPTIONS
clan war - 5 silvers per mob. With this option, when a clan leader declares war with another clan, this mob will automatically be aggressive to that clan and will attack on sight.
rush assist - 5 silvers per mob. With this option, the mob will rush to any clan mob/player that is being attacked and will automatically assist.

ROOM DEFENCES
Hidden exits - 5 silvers per exit.
Traps - 1 gold per trap type. Traps can either cause damage, or snare someone.

These are just preliminary ideas, will add more later. And of course, if you have any other ideas, feel free to add.

[Xeriuth]

Some good ideas for traps horus, but I think the prices might be a little extreme. Maybe 1 silver per 10 levels per mob, so then can upgrade the mob 10 levels for 1 silver each the level of the mob max of level 150 (same as Gojira?) for 1.5gold total. Of course when upgraded the upkeep cost from treasury goes up. If you run out of treasury to pay for the mobs then the mobs will refuse to fight for you and do nothing.
Traps I think should be purchasable with coins. No upkeep, but once set off, are gone forever, one time uses. can always pay in increasing amount of gold to upgrade the traps too, like practicing.

I'm thinking blocker mobs can work just like the script, will attack if an intruder tries to pass, if killed can be passed. Defenders if bought can always assist blocker mobs. Traps can do maybe more functions.. snare, poison, instant damage, teleport, imprison, stun, sleep, perhaps all of these things randomly, never know which trap you'll get when you buy a trap..

Just some quick thoughts will chime in later with more