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Suggestions & Ideas / Re: The IMMs dream of 4d: I want to know
« on: January 31, 2009, 10:09:07 pm »
Although you'd be asking the imms I'll be answering anyways, cause, I do what I want! *chuckle*
.. It's long, happy reading .. '-'
Wonderful I love constructive posts. It's been some time since one! Progress! I'll give my input once again on my views of how to fix such problems.
Grouping: This surely is a problem although it has many ways to be reworked and it's already been changed to divide the exp rewarded equally among any whom of which do damage to the mob. So if you are mounted, and the mount hits, they get exp, if you have a poison weapon, the weapon gets experience, and of course if you have another player in your group that does damage, they receive it as well. Almost needless to say the exp from the mount and weapon is just simply wasted experience.
A quick temporary fix to make grouping more worthwhile and desireable is to give grouping a minor boost in the exp rewarded and keep it divided equally among only the players, nothing else.
This shouldn't hurt anything because if we'd be planning a class overhaul down the road,
everyone is going to lose their remorts anyways so what do we have to lose? If anything we have much to gain, more players having fun and them progressing through the levels much quicker and feeling more accomplished.
Heals: Heals are a problem yes but something that with the current pve and pvp(pk) system is needed. Priests heal for quite a lot on other players, upwards of 2k a heal, it is more than sufficient. 3x heal pots are also more than sufficient but are in turn much more rare than others. I do agree that with the amount of health we can achieve that the 3x cure critic potions are a litte gimped as well as the spell cure critic. Cure light is supposed to be the minor heal, and it surely is, healing around 20health, and curecritic 100 on self, 200-300 on others. I'd imagine that is a quick fix in just changing a few numbers within that portion of the code. I could be wrong, but that is just what I imagine.
Other than that, there really isn't anything that should be done about healing at this point in time because most of it will have to be changed with a new skill/spell/class system.
Alignment: Alignment is kind of pointless, but yes it is relevant as Molly mentioned to a point. I can think of a few such zones that have implemented a few alignment checks for you to perform certain tasks of which you otherwise might now have been allowed to without a certain alignment. But that is very limited, it is a very uncommon to come across this and the limited uses could be changed in a few ways. Such as using Toch's idea of having you choose your alignment during creation, just use that flag then in the quests, if you are evil the mobs respond one way and if good another way. The rewards can be the same or different, or there couldnt be any different responses due to alignment, it'd simply be up to the builder.
All in all I'd like to see Toch's idea implemented which this could then tie into clans...
Clans: Although not mentioned to this point I still feel clans play just as much a viable role in mud growth as grouping. Molly already suggested this back in August while I was in Basic training, so to revisit much of what was said there I'll continue on..
I agree there are too many inactive leaders, or leaders that simply no longer want to be leader. As you said people that log on once a month should not lead clans and that I agree with as well. And with that said we do indeed have too many clans for our current player base. I have a few proposals to clear up this issue which can be very entertaining at the same time beneficial for the time being, but I'll go into that in just a bit.
Let us look at the clans and the clan leaders of such clans at this current time.
We have VIKINGS, DARK-JEDIS, SICILIANS, TABLE ROUND, CHAOS, DRAGONS, SAINTS,
VAMPIRE, WAMPHYRE, SEEKERS and MORDONOSSE
Vikings: Hesara - active
Dark-Jedi: Fiachra - active; Asmoday- logs in, but not very active
Sicilians: Jason- at least logs in semi-frequently; Tocharaeh- active enough
Table Round: Garion- inactive since September 26th, 2008, priorly inactive since March 24th, 2008.
Chaos: Kitolani- active; Virisin- not very active
Dragons: Loran- active; Alayna- inactive
Saints: Riley- active
Vampire: Natalya- not very active
Wamphyre: test clan, irrelevant
Seekers: Activeness is what we hope for!
Mordonosses: Robert: not very active
So in conclusion the inactive clans in respect to their clan leader are Table Round, Vampire, and Mordonosse.
A way to fix inactiveness of clans was laid out very much so in Molly's former post in the General Discussions section of the forums. And all of which could work. Such as:
-Removing all inactive clan leaders manually, but as two of the rather inactive leaders have in fact at least logged in the last month that'd be a bit unfair at this given moment for them.
-Make a retired rank above the clanleader rank where responsibilities of leader position are lost, but the title remains as (Clanname Leader) on who or (Clanname Veteran) or (Clanname Ancient), you get the picture. ;-)
-Maybe have an automatic system that removes clanleaders to the retired rank after a such allocated amount of time has passed. And in turn automatically promotes someone anew.
As Molly said much of this could be too complicated so another solution is to wait for the 'quick' solution and demote such individuals, make note that they were in fact leader. And once the rank is implemented, repromote them to the appropriate rank. That is as temporary a solution as it gets. A simple reminder that there is already, is the 4d clan office where it lists retired leaders. The names will always be there, and until the rank is added that can be sufficient, if that's not good enough for those of such that are considered retired then maybe they should play more to have a say in the matter.
Aside from all of that I have a solution that can also clear up some of the excess clans. I'll start by saying that first off to my knowledge once upon a time there was a clan called Qualinesti, and the Dark-Jedi took them over in some RP fashion sense and the Qualinesti hall became part of the Dark-Jedi. A clan wiped off the map. Later down the road while we did have a decent playerbase the Qualinesti revolted and once again became a clan again of which we now call Mordonosse.
This type of ordeal required little to no effort on the coders part to accomplish. The RP event and everything was made and fashioned by the players and builders. The coders simply had to add a new clan or remove a clan from the system (I'm sure it's possible to even simply comment it out of the code in whatever sections that clan is present).
With that said we could just start eliminating clans as seen fit, as long as a general concensus is ok with that or why not just do it, who is there to complain afterall? Is it going to affect old players to leave? Probably not all who stay, stay for a reason and if we stick around this long there's no much to do to harm that. Also it wouldn't hurt people in staying if anything depending on how the clans come and go add some spice to the mud and might be an attraction. So what I ask is, why not?
Why not, just start doing things about the problems instead of just talking about them. Perhaps let us say that Dark-Jedi is still irritated that the Qualinesti got away so they unleash an assault on the Mordonosse and crush them and enslave them once again. All member of Mordonosse currently can then go to whatever clan of their choosing, and the current clanhall can just be shut off or become connected to the DJ hall, the choice can be up to the current leader I'd imagine. But this scenario can eliminate Mordonosse from the picture. To make it happen just need to have Robert the acting leader agree on this happening.
Let us say Chaos in all its chaoticness spreads the chaos it so chaotically spreads and causes all the vamires to become chaotic and in turn part of chaos, the RP sense of the being vampires remains but they just become part of chaos, and merge the two clans. In time when the playerbase picks up Vampires can split, but at this point it can only benefit to merge the two. I feel they go together the best.
Another scenario could be let us say Table Round gets a new leader and this new leader leads a quest to fight for the right of being a dragon master, afterall knights are in stories are portrayed as dragon slayers, and the dragons clan are known to be dragon masters. Which one wins, the master or the slayers, maybe time will tell?
These cases are something that Tocharaeh would be grand at helping with, as he is very good at writing, as Molly is also. There are many possibilities but this is just what I can think of off the top of my head. Like the even is known in history from times to come as the ultimate clan wars, and are written in the libraries of necromunda and the Town hall of olde yorke. Heck why not just make it really easy and have the imms do this.....
Soooo, you know all you puny mortals, we are imms afterall and we do what we want, so we are taking this, this, and this clan and putting them up for auction, Why, do you ask? Well becasuse we can, and we feel this might in fact clear up much of the inflation in the economy, so have fun bidding! May the mud never be the same again! *cackle*
Classes: Classes are indeed out of wack and my personal favorite that I'd like to see happen that I feel would be most beneficial in growth would in fact be a classless system. Incorporate a huge array of spells and skills so players can decide to be a powerhouse of spells, or a power house of melee, or a powerhouse of healing, or a utility powerhouse, or maybe even a jack of all trades. I gauruntee not everyone will choose the same line up of skills/spells if there is a large large selection, and a limited amount to pick. Most systems with this do not have a remort system and a remort system could be there simply for getting a choice, perhaps more hp per level, an extra skill point to spend on a skill, etc. So everytime one remorts they can choose something new, and their skill/spell choices are removed and must be rediscovered. There are many possibilities for this and I agree it would be wise to start another thread specificially for class. Likewise for skills/spells to perhaps just have everyone think up cool names for spells/skills and descriptions etc, And taht way we can pick and choose down the road.
A classless system will also eliminate class restrictions on equipment which will be nice. However race restrictions should still remain, as to they can make sense to as the reasons they are the way they are.
Equipment: I feel a bit on all sides of the equipment side of things and as to how important it should be. I think at this point in time it is pointless to even make any determination until we would see how a new class system would work. And in turn the stats system might need tweaked as well. It will all require a lot of playertesting, so maybe suggest when we do find a coder up to the challenge, have player tester applications for the testing port to try out new stuff?
That is all for now, I've rattled off everything that was in my thoughts at this point in time, and I know i've rambled a lot, but bear with me, we are trying to makes some progress and I tried to be as constructive as I could. So what do you think?
.. It's long, happy reading .. '-'
Wonderful I love constructive posts. It's been some time since one! Progress! I'll give my input once again on my views of how to fix such problems.
Grouping: This surely is a problem although it has many ways to be reworked and it's already been changed to divide the exp rewarded equally among any whom of which do damage to the mob. So if you are mounted, and the mount hits, they get exp, if you have a poison weapon, the weapon gets experience, and of course if you have another player in your group that does damage, they receive it as well. Almost needless to say the exp from the mount and weapon is just simply wasted experience.
A quick temporary fix to make grouping more worthwhile and desireable is to give grouping a minor boost in the exp rewarded and keep it divided equally among only the players, nothing else.
This shouldn't hurt anything because if we'd be planning a class overhaul down the road,
everyone is going to lose their remorts anyways so what do we have to lose? If anything we have much to gain, more players having fun and them progressing through the levels much quicker and feeling more accomplished.
Heals: Heals are a problem yes but something that with the current pve and pvp(pk) system is needed. Priests heal for quite a lot on other players, upwards of 2k a heal, it is more than sufficient. 3x heal pots are also more than sufficient but are in turn much more rare than others. I do agree that with the amount of health we can achieve that the 3x cure critic potions are a litte gimped as well as the spell cure critic. Cure light is supposed to be the minor heal, and it surely is, healing around 20health, and curecritic 100 on self, 200-300 on others. I'd imagine that is a quick fix in just changing a few numbers within that portion of the code. I could be wrong, but that is just what I imagine.
Other than that, there really isn't anything that should be done about healing at this point in time because most of it will have to be changed with a new skill/spell/class system.
Alignment: Alignment is kind of pointless, but yes it is relevant as Molly mentioned to a point. I can think of a few such zones that have implemented a few alignment checks for you to perform certain tasks of which you otherwise might now have been allowed to without a certain alignment. But that is very limited, it is a very uncommon to come across this and the limited uses could be changed in a few ways. Such as using Toch's idea of having you choose your alignment during creation, just use that flag then in the quests, if you are evil the mobs respond one way and if good another way. The rewards can be the same or different, or there couldnt be any different responses due to alignment, it'd simply be up to the builder.
All in all I'd like to see Toch's idea implemented which this could then tie into clans...
Clans: Although not mentioned to this point I still feel clans play just as much a viable role in mud growth as grouping. Molly already suggested this back in August while I was in Basic training, so to revisit much of what was said there I'll continue on..
I agree there are too many inactive leaders, or leaders that simply no longer want to be leader. As you said people that log on once a month should not lead clans and that I agree with as well. And with that said we do indeed have too many clans for our current player base. I have a few proposals to clear up this issue which can be very entertaining at the same time beneficial for the time being, but I'll go into that in just a bit.
Let us look at the clans and the clan leaders of such clans at this current time.
We have VIKINGS, DARK-JEDIS, SICILIANS, TABLE ROUND, CHAOS, DRAGONS, SAINTS,
VAMPIRE, WAMPHYRE, SEEKERS and MORDONOSSE
Vikings: Hesara - active
Dark-Jedi: Fiachra - active; Asmoday- logs in, but not very active
Sicilians: Jason- at least logs in semi-frequently; Tocharaeh- active enough
Table Round: Garion- inactive since September 26th, 2008, priorly inactive since March 24th, 2008.
Chaos: Kitolani- active; Virisin- not very active
Dragons: Loran- active; Alayna- inactive
Saints: Riley- active
Vampire: Natalya- not very active
Wamphyre: test clan, irrelevant
Seekers: Activeness is what we hope for!
Mordonosses: Robert: not very active
So in conclusion the inactive clans in respect to their clan leader are Table Round, Vampire, and Mordonosse.
A way to fix inactiveness of clans was laid out very much so in Molly's former post in the General Discussions section of the forums. And all of which could work. Such as:
-Removing all inactive clan leaders manually, but as two of the rather inactive leaders have in fact at least logged in the last month that'd be a bit unfair at this given moment for them.
-Make a retired rank above the clanleader rank where responsibilities of leader position are lost, but the title remains as (Clanname Leader) on who or (Clanname Veteran) or (Clanname Ancient), you get the picture. ;-)
-Maybe have an automatic system that removes clanleaders to the retired rank after a such allocated amount of time has passed. And in turn automatically promotes someone anew.
As Molly said much of this could be too complicated so another solution is to wait for the 'quick' solution and demote such individuals, make note that they were in fact leader. And once the rank is implemented, repromote them to the appropriate rank. That is as temporary a solution as it gets. A simple reminder that there is already, is the 4d clan office where it lists retired leaders. The names will always be there, and until the rank is added that can be sufficient, if that's not good enough for those of such that are considered retired then maybe they should play more to have a say in the matter.
Aside from all of that I have a solution that can also clear up some of the excess clans. I'll start by saying that first off to my knowledge once upon a time there was a clan called Qualinesti, and the Dark-Jedi took them over in some RP fashion sense and the Qualinesti hall became part of the Dark-Jedi. A clan wiped off the map. Later down the road while we did have a decent playerbase the Qualinesti revolted and once again became a clan again of which we now call Mordonosse.
This type of ordeal required little to no effort on the coders part to accomplish. The RP event and everything was made and fashioned by the players and builders. The coders simply had to add a new clan or remove a clan from the system (I'm sure it's possible to even simply comment it out of the code in whatever sections that clan is present).
With that said we could just start eliminating clans as seen fit, as long as a general concensus is ok with that or why not just do it, who is there to complain afterall? Is it going to affect old players to leave? Probably not all who stay, stay for a reason and if we stick around this long there's no much to do to harm that. Also it wouldn't hurt people in staying if anything depending on how the clans come and go add some spice to the mud and might be an attraction. So what I ask is, why not?
Why not, just start doing things about the problems instead of just talking about them. Perhaps let us say that Dark-Jedi is still irritated that the Qualinesti got away so they unleash an assault on the Mordonosse and crush them and enslave them once again. All member of Mordonosse currently can then go to whatever clan of their choosing, and the current clanhall can just be shut off or become connected to the DJ hall, the choice can be up to the current leader I'd imagine. But this scenario can eliminate Mordonosse from the picture. To make it happen just need to have Robert the acting leader agree on this happening.
Let us say Chaos in all its chaoticness spreads the chaos it so chaotically spreads and causes all the vamires to become chaotic and in turn part of chaos, the RP sense of the being vampires remains but they just become part of chaos, and merge the two clans. In time when the playerbase picks up Vampires can split, but at this point it can only benefit to merge the two. I feel they go together the best.
Another scenario could be let us say Table Round gets a new leader and this new leader leads a quest to fight for the right of being a dragon master, afterall knights are in stories are portrayed as dragon slayers, and the dragons clan are known to be dragon masters. Which one wins, the master or the slayers, maybe time will tell?
These cases are something that Tocharaeh would be grand at helping with, as he is very good at writing, as Molly is also. There are many possibilities but this is just what I can think of off the top of my head. Like the even is known in history from times to come as the ultimate clan wars, and are written in the libraries of necromunda and the Town hall of olde yorke. Heck why not just make it really easy and have the imms do this.....
Soooo, you know all you puny mortals, we are imms afterall and we do what we want, so we are taking this, this, and this clan and putting them up for auction, Why, do you ask? Well becasuse we can, and we feel this might in fact clear up much of the inflation in the economy, so have fun bidding! May the mud never be the same again! *cackle*
Classes: Classes are indeed out of wack and my personal favorite that I'd like to see happen that I feel would be most beneficial in growth would in fact be a classless system. Incorporate a huge array of spells and skills so players can decide to be a powerhouse of spells, or a power house of melee, or a powerhouse of healing, or a utility powerhouse, or maybe even a jack of all trades. I gauruntee not everyone will choose the same line up of skills/spells if there is a large large selection, and a limited amount to pick. Most systems with this do not have a remort system and a remort system could be there simply for getting a choice, perhaps more hp per level, an extra skill point to spend on a skill, etc. So everytime one remorts they can choose something new, and their skill/spell choices are removed and must be rediscovered. There are many possibilities for this and I agree it would be wise to start another thread specificially for class. Likewise for skills/spells to perhaps just have everyone think up cool names for spells/skills and descriptions etc, And taht way we can pick and choose down the road.
A classless system will also eliminate class restrictions on equipment which will be nice. However race restrictions should still remain, as to they can make sense to as the reasons they are the way they are.
Equipment: I feel a bit on all sides of the equipment side of things and as to how important it should be. I think at this point in time it is pointless to even make any determination until we would see how a new class system would work. And in turn the stats system might need tweaked as well. It will all require a lot of playertesting, so maybe suggest when we do find a coder up to the challenge, have player tester applications for the testing port to try out new stuff?
That is all for now, I've rattled off everything that was in my thoughts at this point in time, and I know i've rambled a lot, but bear with me, we are trying to makes some progress and I tried to be as constructive as I could. So what do you think?
I think you know 