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Suggestions & Ideas / Re: CASTERS, DMG, HP: Serious problems.
« on: July 27, 2009, 08:08:42 am »
A select few only becomes a problem if the benefit is so overpowering - such as pratically doubling the rate you can level. You're left with the haves and the have nots, based purely on knowing someone that gets lucky.
I like the actual features myself too, but they do need seriously toned down in strength. Better staves should only be giving slightly more multiplier, and perhaps tinkering with weapons only affect the size of the weapons damage dice, not both values (ie. a 10d10 weapon is tinkered to 10dxx, rather than xxdxx as it is now).
Tocharaeh's first post is partly trying to raise the issue of classes being interdependent. 4D's classes are not really like this, - what others might expect a 'tank' class to be (like a warrior) are not really specialist tanks, while the current spellcasters that are easily made into high damage types (thanks to high +charisma items) can still absorb damage effectively as well.
These are basic game mechanic issues involving hitpoints, accuracy, damage, mobs stats, armour, and so on. They wont be affected by changing what skills or spells a class recieves or giving an extra bonus here and there. The suggested skill tree will add more variation, but to address this it will still be necessary to look at how everything is tied together.
Which leaves an odd one out: Gypsy. Gypsy is the only class in 4d that seems built as a 'support' class - its main features (tinker, woodsing) are in effect transferable to other players because they affect items rather than being skills or spells used just by them. Should such powerful abilities that are wanted by every class be limited to just one? I'm not sure they should be.
Making them available via a quest is one option, or you could even limit them to races - woodsing to all elves, and tinker to all dwarves for example. If you gave all races different unique strengths like this, it might make everyone feel more unique immediately, which I think everyone would welcome.
And that is the crux of the issue for me: The classes seem, even with different skills and spells, to play in a basic similar manner. No natural interdependency to encourage grouping and teamwork, no variation in what equipment you want to wear (+damroll or +cha from items, all other stats get left behind) which might encourage trading, and a sense that everyone plays very similarly to each other.
In summary:
Fix the basics first please.
Every character, whatever their class, should get some kind of ability, spell set, natural strength or something that is unique to them, and will make them vital to have around. Without this all the classes merge into one large blob of collective boredom.
I like the actual features myself too, but they do need seriously toned down in strength. Better staves should only be giving slightly more multiplier, and perhaps tinkering with weapons only affect the size of the weapons damage dice, not both values (ie. a 10d10 weapon is tinkered to 10dxx, rather than xxdxx as it is now).
Tocharaeh's first post is partly trying to raise the issue of classes being interdependent. 4D's classes are not really like this, - what others might expect a 'tank' class to be (like a warrior) are not really specialist tanks, while the current spellcasters that are easily made into high damage types (thanks to high +charisma items) can still absorb damage effectively as well.
These are basic game mechanic issues involving hitpoints, accuracy, damage, mobs stats, armour, and so on. They wont be affected by changing what skills or spells a class recieves or giving an extra bonus here and there. The suggested skill tree will add more variation, but to address this it will still be necessary to look at how everything is tied together.
Which leaves an odd one out: Gypsy. Gypsy is the only class in 4d that seems built as a 'support' class - its main features (tinker, woodsing) are in effect transferable to other players because they affect items rather than being skills or spells used just by them. Should such powerful abilities that are wanted by every class be limited to just one? I'm not sure they should be.
Making them available via a quest is one option, or you could even limit them to races - woodsing to all elves, and tinker to all dwarves for example. If you gave all races different unique strengths like this, it might make everyone feel more unique immediately, which I think everyone would welcome.
And that is the crux of the issue for me: The classes seem, even with different skills and spells, to play in a basic similar manner. No natural interdependency to encourage grouping and teamwork, no variation in what equipment you want to wear (+damroll or +cha from items, all other stats get left behind) which might encourage trading, and a sense that everyone plays very similarly to each other.
In summary:
Fix the basics first please.
Every character, whatever their class, should get some kind of ability, spell set, natural strength or something that is unique to them, and will make them vital to have around. Without this all the classes merge into one large blob of collective boredom.