Spells

[Virisin]

I'm just making a thread about spells because they seem badly organised.. And I was wondering what other people thought:

Currently there are spells like demonshreak that arn't much better than spells like fireball.. Even though demonshreak is a tier 4 spell that requires -1000 align, and fireball is a tier 1 spell.. And with 'mind fire' fireball gets better anyway.. Some spells cost far too much mana for the damage they do, and some spells have timers so you can't cast them more than like once a day.  Some caster classes don't get spells that compliment their elemental strengths - or if they do, they're the crap spells that either cost too much mana, or have timer delays on casting multiple times..

Basically it seems a shambles, either spell strength should depend on what tier you get it, and should have mana cost and timers to match, or they should be strategically placed so each caster class gets some good spells that work with their elemental strengths aswel as getting the 'mind' spell to match them..

Or even a new spell system that just let's us research our own spells, name them, give them their elemental strengths, and have their strength depend on how strong the caster is, aswel as when we researched them.. Researching could cost cash, more cash = stronger spell.. (up to a limit of course).. It'd also mean we wouldn't need so many spells that just don't seem to make sense..

Thoughts?

[erwin]

Currently there are spells like demonshreak that arn't much better than spells like fireball.. Even though demonshreak is a tier 4 spell that requires -1000 align, and fireball is a tier 1 spell.. And with 'mind fire' fireball gets better anyway.. Some spells cost far too much mana for the damage they do, and some spells have timers so you can't cast them more than like once a day.  Undecided Some caster classes don't get spells that compliment their elemental strengths - or if they do, they're the crap spells that either cost too much mana, or have timer delays on casting multiple times..

Yes. Tried them out with gladiator chars, the tier 3 and 4 offensive spells don't seem comparable.

I like the idea of a new spell system, but would that be hard to implement in the code? Besides, wouldn't that pretty well remove the distinction between priest, mage and esper? (Letting mage, priest, esper research their own respective spells would be pretty much like just boosting up the spells currently)

[Virisin]

Yeh, I quite like the idea of a new spell system aswel.. I'm trying to think now how to incorporate it into the current classes, if you were just able to research spells.. I guess there would be different attributes for researching that each seperate caster class got? Mages being the uber damage spell class would get to put +percentage damage dealt on their spells researched, priests would get the defensive buff attributes to research and espers would get the weakening spells to research..? Here's an example:

When you research a spell, you get to give it a name, determine how much mana you want it to cost per cast (which would affect the attributes the spell gets).

If you're mage your spells are gonna be damage spells and upping the mana cost would up the damage dealt - +10% damage, +15% damage, 20% damage... Whatever.

If you're priest your spells are gonna be defensive spells and upping the mana cost would increase the strength of the defence.. +10% protection against whatever.. (there'd have to be choices) +15% protection.. Etc..

If you're esper your spells are gonna be to do with despelling opponents and upping the mana cost would weaken the opponent more.. -10% to opponents protectoin.. Whatever..

The research would end up costing an amount of cash depending on how strong you made the spell, and there'd be a limit to how much cash you could put into researching, and so a limit to spell strength.. Still thinking this idea up as I go.. Will post more as I think more..

[Mordecai]

Currently there are spells like demonshreak that arn't much better than spells like fireball.. Even though demonshreak is a tier 4 spell that requires -1000 align, and fireball is a tier 1 spell.. And with 'mind fire' fireball gets better anyway.. Some spells cost far too much mana for the damage they do, and some spells have timers so you can't cast them more than like once a day.  Undecided Some caster classes don't get spells that compliment their elemental strengths - or if they do, they're the crap spells that either cost too much mana, or have timer delays on casting multiple times..

Yes. Tried them out with gladiator chars, the tier 3 and 4 offensive spells don't seem comparable.

I like the idea of a new spell system, but would that be hard to implement in the code? Besides, wouldn't that pretty well remove the distinction between priest, mage and esper? (Letting mage, priest, esper research their own respective spells would be pretty much like just boosting up the spells currently)

Well, those spells like demonshreak, are circumstancially good.

If you cast demonshreak on a good aligned rogue mob.
You will do at least a modifier of 3.0x
Cast on a good aligned normal mob, you get a modifier of 2.6x
Cast on a good aligned player you get a modifier of 2.4x

And fireball, at its best:
Mind fire + cast during the day in a desert  = modifier of 2.15x

[erwin]

I've played a gladiator priest in the arena, and while I never tried fireball, harm is a T1L30 spell, and it has a multiplier of 2.85 with devine mind.

[nanukimo]

even a new spell system that just let's us research our own spells, name them, give them their elemental strengths, and have their strength depend on how strong the caster is, aswel as when we researched them.. Researching could cost cash, more cash = stronger spell.. (up to a limit of course).. It'd also mean we wouldn't need so many spells that just don't seem to make sense..

Thoughts?

Thinking your stealing Ideas from other muds.

[Virisin]

I always do.. Everyone does.. I like the way that spell system works somewhat, not totally though.

[Fizban]

even a new spell system that just let's us research our own spells, name them, give them their elemental strengths, and have their strength depend on how strong the caster is, aswel as when we researched them.. Researching could cost cash, more cash = stronger spell.. (up to a limit of course).. It'd also mean we wouldn't need so many spells that just don't seem to make sense..

Thoughts?

Thinking your stealing Ideas from other muds.

Yeah, it does scream Aeonian Dreams.

[Kvetch]

Just because the idea is from another mud doesn't make it bad.  The thought sounds neat, but I wonder how much coding would go in to making it.  So.. how much change would we be talking?  It's like the remort system - too much change means it won't get done no matter how cool it sounds.

Kvetch

[Mordecai]

even a new spell system that just let's us research our own spells, name them, give them their elemental strengths, and have their strength depend on how strong the caster is, aswel as when we researched them.. Researching could cost cash, more cash = stronger spell.. (up to a limit of course).. It'd also mean we wouldn't need so many spells that just don't seem to make sense..

Thoughts?

As much as having massively customisable spell system sounds great, it has many draw backs.
The more variables you have to learn, the longer it takes to learn how to play, and it is harder to make successful intuitive choices from the start.

I am happy to clean up, rearrange, or reduce our existing spells.
But for customisable stuff, I think i will leave that to the professions that molly is making.

[Virisin]

I agree, I was just putting it out there as another option.

I do still think the current spells just need a little rearranging though. There's nothing wrong with the amount of spells, it's just that they seem randomly organised, not only strengthwise, but class allocated wise.