Author Topic: SUBskill System  (Read 38448 times)

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Offline Loran

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2009, 07:52:49 pm »
i was always curious if it was decided if the dragon subskills were actually summoned dragonlike pets similar to golems, or just really pretty looking teleport scripts? ???

Offline Kvetch

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #16 on: August 03, 2009, 09:54:04 pm »
You know as much as I do now.  *heh*  From what some of the skills sound like it almost sounds like you actually get a mount.  who knew.

Offline Tocharaeh

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2009, 10:04:55 pm »
seems kinda crappy to make mounts... how does this effect perz mounts? any ideas?
-Tocharaeh D'Araesth
The Dirty Ol'' Drow that time left behind in fear of obliteration!

Offline Molly

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Re: Dragonmaster skills
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2009, 08:16:40 am »
The dragons are not supposed to work like normal mounts.
A Dragon will load when summoned, and you can mount and dismount it, but it won't do your bidding or help you in fights, nor can it be attacked. It's just there for the visual effect. It might not even be a real mob, just a scripted illusion, whichever is easier to do.
The player with the Dragonmaster skill can use the Dragon as transport for himself. If he is skilled enough, he can also take players that lack the skill with him as passengers.

The Dragonmaster skills are just a transport system, which will take you to various pre-set locations on demand, either remote locations in the game or special minizones with quests to carry out, which are otherwise unaccessable and !teleport_in. Some of these quests will be part of learning the subskill. All in all, there might be 10-20 different Dragonports, but that is of course dependant on how many Ports we'll make in the normal Medieval world, and how many questzones Kvetch wants to make.  

There will for instance be Dragonports in all cardinal directions - on Dragon Island, Land's End, the Stormspike, Cloud City in RIP, and probly some in Enchanted Lands and Midlands as well. There will also be one relatively central Dragonport, probably close to Greenie in Sherwood Forest. I'd like to put a port close to the Dragon Caves as well, but since that is an Uber zone, it might be too dangerous. Possibly we could also provide dragonflights to some locations in Pre, but I am a bit unsure there, since Dragons weren't really a part of Greek and Egypt mythology.

Anyhow, it's pretty much a variation of the shuttles in Future, but it will provide some nice shortcuts that the Medieval Dimensions lacks at present, plus some exclusive quests, and hopefully it will look impressive too, for those players that lack the skill.

For instance every Dragon flight could pass over Recall, displaying a room echo there;
'Player-name passes overhead, mounted on a red dragon and heading northwards.'
or
'Player-name flies by southwards, mounted on the huge Green Dragon and carrying the passengers Tom, Dick and Harry'.
( I guess someone could think of more impressive echoes, but that's the general idea).

« Last Edit: August 04, 2009, 08:29:20 am by Molly »

Offline Prometheus

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2009, 05:20:25 pm »
This who subskill system with professions and professional groups is an royal mess. It is probably gonna take me a while to get it ironed out but I will try to make things more clearer and hopefully work out the bugs with prof command.

Prometheus

Offline Virisin

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #20 on: November 10, 2009, 12:27:22 am »
I think subskills should be removed and adapted in with this new skill system.

Offline Kvetch

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2009, 01:52:05 pm »
Dang, I'm agreeing with whats-'is-name too much.

Subskills should just be other skills that you can pick up.  I'm not sure how, with a new skill tree system, you'd be able to tell the two apart anyway.  Would there be any reason to NOT put them in the skill tree system and keep them as subskills?

Offline Virisin

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2009, 02:19:49 pm »
Well, with a new skill tree system every skill would have something like 20 ranks to improve it in, and the 20th rank would include a 'mastery' of the skill which would mean some small quest. This would be the absolute and total specialization possible with that skill, and it would only be possible with about 4 or 5 skills per character. There is only like 1 subskill currently in the game that was ever actually well thought out - garotte - and in a skilltree system I very much see garotte being a specialized skill and so the current quest could be put in for the mastery of the skill fairly easily. Things like pillage are less like real skills and harder to fit, but to be honest, pillage is a terrible subskill anyway - it simply adds to inflation and nothing really else. I understand 'pillaging' is a nifty concept but when all it does is give more gold per kill and everyone has it, it just doesn't really fit in the mud. Kinda like physics.. Nifty concept but doesn't really fit with the mud. :P

Offline Prometheus

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #23 on: November 12, 2009, 09:58:45 pm »
Molly asked me to look into this and I am looking into this for Molly. Bring it up with her  ::)

Prometheus

Offline Molly

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2009, 08:51:51 am »
Here is some more background info:

Originally the subskills were implemented because we ran out of skill slots - there was a cap on 200 skills in total. And since Mordecai didn't fancy expanding the number allowed, he decided to go for subskills instead, which I assume meant a lot less coding work.
Since then Anubis has done some coding and the #200 cap no longer exists.

However, only a very small part of the subskills that were originally planned were implemented, because Mord lost time and interest halfway. And somewhere along the way, the subskills changed character too, and became more like 'profession' skills. Only a few of them are actually combat related, most were meant to be about things like performing (juggling, acrobatics etc), transporting (the Dragon skills), manufacturing (like Cooking, Brewing, and the entire Craftskill group), spaceship related (like Dogfighting and Navigating). And then there was the Vampire group (Drainblood, Nightregen, Furyattack), which was supposed to be part of a vampiric affliction, which was never implemented, but for some reason some of the subskills related to it were. Too many things left unfinished...

As it stands, the big difference - and also the big advantage - with subskills is, that they are independent of Class and Tier/Level. Once you've learnt a subskill, you keep it through all remorts, regardless which class you remort to. The only exception, I think, are the combat related subskills Garotte and Throttle, for which you need to have the thief skill Strangle to be able to use. (At least that's how it was supposed to work, strangle and garotte are Thief exclusive skills).

Now if we keep the subskill system during the code change to skilltrees, the advantage of a subskill that is class-independent would be even more obvious.

If I have any say in it, I'd like to keep the subskills that actually were implemented, because a lot of work got into setting up the quests for those, and I hate to see work go to waste. Whether they will still be class independent, or integrated in the skill-trees is a decision the coder will have to make, and I'll discuss that with Anubis. Probably they need to be balanced in the new system too. I don't care much either way, as long as we keep the ones that are already in, at least in some form.

For now, I'd just like to clean up the way they are displayed to the players, because that is very confusing and vastly misleading. If you type subslkills, or professions in the game, you'll understand why.

Maybe the easiest way to go about it temporarily would be to simply disable those two commands for mortals, until we decided what to do about them.

I'll also have to remove the info about Professions and Subskills that I went ahead of time and put in the Travel Agency.  I let myself get carried away and believe that what we dicussed would also actually happen. Should have known better... :P






Offline Virisin

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #25 on: November 13, 2009, 04:46:05 pm »
If we do integrate subskills into skill trees all the ones currently in the game would be kept. With a skilltree system it is likely there would be about 20 ranks in each skill, and either getting to the 20th rank, or essentially getting to the 21st rank would entail 'mastering' the skill which would probably be some small quest. With something like throttle, all the work is already done in that regard.

Offline Prometheus

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #26 on: November 16, 2009, 08:20:34 pm »
So I guess what my question is should I fix subskills now or after the changes. I'm not going to waste time fixing something that wil lget changed soon.

Prometheus

Offline Virisin

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2009, 08:48:51 pm »
I'd say after changes, or likely with changes.

Offline Kvetch

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2009, 11:34:59 pm »
Talked to Anubis today and he said the Dragon master skills (in particular) would be outside of the skill tree skills - more like a profession.  Also realized that all I had to do was give the skills and let coders worry about the asthetics when they were being used.  ;)

Offline Molly

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Re: SUBskill System
« Reply #29 on: November 17, 2009, 02:10:16 am »
Prometheus, could you just fix it so that the commands subskills and professions isn't viewable for morts. Then at least we wouldn't have misleading info to players.